In-n-out shooting in Idaho

[RustVendor]

Don’t be knocking In N Out. Yea it’s a mid burger. But ironically is more affordable than just about any fast food joint. It was my first job and did it for almost 4 years. Great company to work for.

your icon needs the in n out hat

 

[Gawernator]

View attachment 232842

i wonder what would happen if we looked at other things into this, what would happen when we look at R people saying about EV

Let me guess, landline phone survey with a median age of the respondent being 67? lmao

 

[Wolkenflieger]

Conservatives have only liked Teslas for like 2 years. The president literally cut all the EV rebates and is trying to stop renewable energy projects.

i wonder what would happen if we looked at other things into this, what would happen when we look at R people saying about EV

Adorable. What we're talking about is ACTUAL sales. Best-selling car of 2025 was the Toyota RAV 4, only narrowly beating the Tesla Model Y.

Toyota RAV 4 sales= 1.01 Million Units
Tesla Model Y sales=.99 Million Units
Toyota Corolla sales= .98 Million

Feel free to verify these numbers.

Now, why would a PURE electric vehicle beat out one of the longtime top-sellers (the Corolla) and almost reach the top spot in sales? That's how good it is, and EVs are inherently better than ICE vehicles in so many respects. In other years (2024 or so) it WAS the number one selling car on the planet. This is a pure BEV, or battery electric vehicle. So, a lot of people still don't have a clue about EVs, let alone Tesla (the best EV in the U.S.).

Also, the Model Y is the safest vehicle EVER TESTED by the NHTSA. Model 3 (the one I have) is second safest.

My Tesla also drives itself (full self-driving) and it's 7x safer than humans in aggregate. Teslas have been driven across North America at least twice now (Canada and the U.S.) using self-driving (FSD) only, no interventions. All of this is tracked with Tesla's telemetry data. For any aging population or anyone who's disabled in a way where driving is difficult, FSD is looking like a really good option if the driver can still supervise. Granted, the supervised state will go away at some point.

Right now, Teslas have unmanned Robotaxis carting people around in different states, starting in Austin, TX. This is a car with no driver at all, just a passenger in one of the back seats. Waymo kinda does this, but it uses all kinds of expensive equipment and is geofenced. Teslas come out of the factory able to drive themselves, and Tesla has delivered vehicles to customers that drove themselves to the customer's house.

So yeah, EVs are really good now (especially Tesla) and no amount of disinformation will change that.

 

[Wolkenflieger]

Conservatives have only liked Teslas for like 2 years. The president literally cut all the EV rebates and is trying to stop renewable energy projects.

This has nothing to do with the merit of EVs or Teslas. Tesla sales were going hog wile even when dementia Biden was actively trying to suppress Tesla and their sales. He failed to invite Elon and Tesla to the American EV Summit, which is like not inviting Apple to an American smartphone summit.

But, Tesla sells cars worldwide, not just in the States.

 

[grandpapeepap]

Adorable. What we're talking about is ACTUAL sales. Best-selling car of 2025 was the Toyota RAV 4, only narrowly beating the Tesla Model Y.

Toyota RAV 4 sales= 1.01 Million Units
Tesla Model Y sales=.99 Million Units
Toyota Corolla sales= .98 Million

Feel free to verify these numbers.

Now, why would a PURE electric vehicle beat out one of the longtime top-sellers (the Corolla) and almost reach the top spot in sales? That's how good it is, and EVs are inherently better than ICE vehicles in so many respects. In other years (2024 or so) it WAS the number one selling car on the planet. This is a pure BEV, or battery electric vehicle. So, a lot of people still don't have a clue about EVs, let alone Tesla (the best EV in the U.S.).

Also, the Model Y is the safest vehicle EVER TESTED by the NHTSA. Model 3 (the one I have) is second safest.

My Tesla also drives itself (full self-driving) and it's 7x safer than humans in aggregate. Teslas have been driven across North America at least twice now (Canada and the U.S.) using self-driving (FSD) only, no interventions. All of this is tracked with Tesla's telemetry data. For any aging population or anyone who's disabled in a way where driving is difficult, FSD is looking like a really good option if the driver can still supervise. Granted, the supervised state will go away at some point.

Right now, Teslas have unmanned Robotaxis carting people around in different states, starting in Austin, TX. This is a car with no driver at all, just a passenger in one of the back seats. Waymo kinda does this, but it uses all kinds of expensive equipment and is geofenced. Teslas come out of the factory able to drive themselves, and Tesla has delivered vehicles to customers that drove themselves to the customer's house.

So yeah, EVs are really good now (especially Tesla) and no amount of disinformation will change that.

where were those sales in ? blue states and swing states not red ones? you can believe what you want. we arent saying EVs are bad idk why you bring that up at the end or their safety record but to muddy the conversation, we are talking about certain folks on a certain side of the aisle not liking them. which you havent disputed at all just pointed to total numbers which would include libs.

 

[HibikiR]

Well, the Tesla Model Y did come out in 2020, Q1 IIRC.

Elon Musk left Democrats in May 2022. Democrats had about 2 years of buying Tesla Ys with a clear conscience, but Wolkenflieger was specific about the 2025 year so if we focus on polls from that year, Republicans were far more likely to be buyers than Democrats.

Tesla gaining with Republicans as it loses traction with Democrats: Stifel

Stifel's Think Tank Group data has shown that Democrats' net favorability of Tesla fell to -15% from 7% since February 2024, while Republicans' rose to 27% from 11%.

www.teslarati.com

 

[grandpapeepap]

Well, the Tesla Model Y did come out in 2020, Q1 IIRC.

Elon Musk left Democrats in May 2022. Democrats had about 2 years of buying Tesla Ys with a clear conscience, but Wolkenflieger was specific about the 2025 year so if we focus on polls from that year, Republicans were far more likely to be buyers than Democrats.

Tesla gaining with Republicans as it loses traction with Democrats: Stifel

Stifel's Think Tank Group data has shown that Democrats' net favorability of Tesla fell to -15% from 7% since February 2024, while Republicans' rose to 27% from 11%.

www.teslarati.com

and like my picture showed, less than 20% would recommend EVs to others for those republicans, vs how much for democrats. higher or lower

 

[HibikiR]

How many Democrats would recommend Tesla Ys in 2025?

Also relevant to Wolkenflieger's post, Toyota donated 1 million dollars to Trump's 2025 inauguration. I'd imagine that news didn't sit well with Democrats in the market for a Corolla in 2025.

Did Toyota donate to trump

Executive summary Toyota Motor North America publicly pledged and donated $1 million to Donald Trump’s 2025 inaugural fund, a seven‑figure contribution r...

factually.co

 

[RustVendor]

This has nothing to do with the merit of EVs or Teslas. Tesla sales were going hog wile even when dementia Biden was actively trying to suppress Tesla and their sales. He failed to invite Elon and Tesla to the American EV Summit, which is like not inviting Apple to an American smartphone summit.

But, Tesla sells cars worldwide, not just in the States.

nothing that you are talking about has anything to do with what I'm saying I literally have no idea what you are talking about. Teslas are fine, but the current administration is hostile to EVs and non fossil fuels in general, the only reason conservatives latched on is that Teslas became part of the culture war due to Elon. But Conservatives as a political faction are hostile towards EVs and the energy required to use them. The really big irony with that is that lots of people driving EVs would mean lower gas prices due to demand. Promoting EVs and "green energy" would be good for people who love to drive gas automobiles, especially in times like this where we are ing around in Iran and letting gas companies rape us.

 

[Wolkenflieger]

where were those sales in ? blue states and swing states not red ones? you can believe what you want. we arent saying EVs are bad idk why you bring that up at the end or their safety record but to muddy the conversation, we are talking about certain folks on a certain side of the aisle not liking them. which you havent disputed at all just pointed to total numbers which would include libs.

Which part of "worldwide sales" do you not understand? The point is about sales. If you want to drill down into the minutia of demographics, I'm sure the info is out there. You lost the point and now you're backpedaling or hand-waving.

 

[Wolkenflieger]

Well, the Tesla Model Y did come out in 2020, Q1 IIRC.

Elon Musk left Democrats in May 2022. Democrats had about 2 years of buying Tesla Ys with a clear conscience, but Wolkenflieger was specific about the 2025 year so if we focus on polls from that year, Republicans were far more likely to be buyers than Democrats.

Tesla gaining with Republicans as it loses traction with Democrats: Stifel

Stifel's Think Tank Group data has shown that Democrats' net favorability of Tesla fell to -15% from 7% since February 2024, while Republicans' rose to 27% from 11%.

www.teslarati.com

The Tesla Model Y has been a top seller for years now. Quick Google search yields this;

"The Tesla Model Y first became the best-selling vehicle in the world in 2023 (when it sold roughly 1.22 million units), marking the first time an electric vehicle captured the global top spot. Tesla and tracking data indicate it maintained this position for 2024 and 2025 as well, achieving a three-year streak, though independent automotive researchers note some close competition and ongoing debate over final registration tallies for the later years."

 

[grandpapeepap]

Which part of "worldwide sales" do you not understand? The point is about sales. If you want to drill down into the minutia of demographics, I'm sure the info is out there. You lost the point and now you're backpedaling or hand-waving.

we werent talking about the world, we were talking about which group doesnt like EVs, you bring up stuff that isnt relevant and try to NOU and project stuff. even rustvendor pointed it out.

 

[Wolkenflieger]

nothing that you are talking about has anything to do with what I'm saying I literally have no idea what you are talking about. Teslas are fine, but the current administration is hostile to EVs and non fossil fuels in general, the only reason conservatives latched on is that Teslas became part of the culture war due to Elon. But Conservatives as a political faction are hostile towards EVs and the energy required to use them. The really big irony with that is that lots of people driving EVs would mean lower gas prices due to demand. Promoting EVs and "green energy" would be good for people who love to drive gas automobiles, especially in times like this where we are ing around in Iran and letting gas companies rape us.

Trump is hardly "hostile" to EVs, and he's been (mostly) friendly with Elon. Hell, did you not see Trump buying some Teslas on the front lawn of the White House? He bought a Model S Plaid which he gave to his granddaughter, Kaia Trump. He may have bought others too. If any president in living memory was hostile to EVs, it was Biden as like I already wrote—he omitted Tesla from the American EV Summit which is like not inviting Apple to an American smart phone Summit. In other words, stupid.

Conservatives as a whole are not all hostile toward EVs, again, because Elon directly helped get Trump elected AND saved the free world (hyperbole) by buying and fixing Twitter (now called X). Without the Twitter purchase and the Twitter files, we wouldn't have seen how much the levers of communication were being controlled by the far Left. There's nothing about a superior car (a Tesla EV) which should be repugnant to conservatives. Conservatives are not stupid, and they like vehicles. They also like trucks and QUICK vehicles that obviously demonstrate superior power. They like independence, and nothing frees one from the grid (and gas) more than solar charging, which is how I charge my Tesla. I haven't been to a gas station for any reason since 2020.

I too appreciate power and the lovely noises that come from an exotic or muscle car, but EVs are inherently quicker for the money, and there's no racket announcing to every cop that you're getting on it when one has the "need for speed". ICE owners all over the world have found this out firsthand, should they be interested in such things. If you've never rented or driven a Tesla, then it behooves you to see what all the fuss is about. That's what I did.

Like most of us over-55 types, I cut my teeth on ICE vehicles and I even rode motorcycles for 20+ years. I drive EVs because they're better in almost every measurable way. The one area where one could say they're lacking is TTC (time-to-charge) compared to quick (and expensive) gas fill-ups at gas stations with attendant gas spills, non-working pumps, credit card skimmers, and incidental crime. Nothing beats charging at home and waking up to a "full tank" of electrons from the word "go". My Tesla does 0-60 in under 3 seconds too, and was under 60k. As I mentioned prior, it really does drive itself and most people have NO concept of how good this is, especially if they've never experienced it firsthand.

But yeah, I charge daily from our local star (the sun). Granted, this requires the sunk cost of solar, but solar is far more useful than for charging EVs. A lot of people without EVs have solar because it lowers electricity costs, AND frees up the grid for those who still use it.

Further, those who can sell energy back to the grid (via solar and battery storage) become a "virtual power station".

On X, almost all of my Tesla friends are conservative. The tide has definitely turned here, demographically.

 

[grandpapeepap]

solar is pretty motherless in for power in our state

 

[Wolkenflieger]

we werent talking about the world, we were talking about which group doesnt like EVs, you bring up stuff that isnt relevant and try to NOU and project stuff. even rustvendor pointed it out.

I already pointed out the hostility from the Left. I'm talking about sales worldwide. We've seen some s refuse to buy Teslas because of Elon, obviously, but that's expected given his role in Trump's administration and helping him get elected. He also bought and freed Twitter (now X) and s are pissed about that too. Elon has also promised to help republicans in the mid-terms and that isn't helping.

The reality is that Tesla sales are doing just fine despite your hand-waving about demographics.

 

[Wolkenflieger]

solar is pretty motherless in for power in our state

Yes it is, hot AF here. If you have battery storage, even better. If the power goes out for any reason the battery can take over in milliseconds, so fast that your computer won't even shut down.

 

[grandpapeepap]

I already pointed out the hostility from the Left. I'm talking about sales worldwide. We've seen some s refuse to buy Teslas because of Elon, obviously, but that's expected given his role in Trump's administration and helping him get elected. He also bought and freed Twitter (now X) and s are pissed about that too. Elon has also promised to help republicans in the mid-terms and that isn't helping.

The reality is that Tesla sales are doing just fine despite your hand-waving about demographics.

i never brought up their sales numbers, i brought up numbers that right wingers wouldnt recommend EVs and left wingers do more recommendations. please dont shadowbox.

 

[Wolkenflieger]

i never brought up their sales numbers, i brought up numbers that right wingers wouldnt recommend EVs and left wingers do more recommendations. please dont shadowbox.

You are free to do a deep dive into demographics. I'm talking about worldwide sales. I'm keenly aware of how the demo has changed and myself I've been on both sides of the political fence as a Tesla owner, so I've seen it firsthand from both sides.

Hell, I know one lefty who says he hates Elon and he STILL drives a Tesla. They're that good.

 

[HibikiR]

In my experience, left wingers in 2025 would push for Rivians or Lucids and not push for Teslas. YMMV.

 

[Wolkenflieger]

In my experience, left wingers in 2025 would push for Rivians or Lucids and not push for Teslas. YMMV.

This is true. Most Left-wingers committed to their political ideology won't buy a Tesla, but some already bought Teslas and refuse to sell despite disliking some of Elon's decisions, speech, behavior, etc.. I know at least one of those.

Some will put those goofy anti-Elon stickers on their cars despite driving one, as if they need to virtue-signal to their fellow Lefties.