Observations on temp and position sensitivity with reduced Red Dot loads

[NapalmCheese]

I used to have a bunch of Red Dot. Because of that, when it came to making light recoiling reduced velocity handgun loads (and .30-30) I'd load a light charge of Red Dot in whatever case. For .45 LC that comes out to 4.5 grains of Red Dot under a Bear Creek moly/polymer coated 205 RNFP and for .38 SPC it's 3.1 grains under a Chevy Cast polymer coated 125 grain RNFP.

Fun observation time, when I ran these loads over the chrono to make sure I was making the minimum velocity/power factor I found that the first round out of the holster was nearly always 50-80 fps slower than the subsequent rounds. My theory is that walking around with the guns holstered allows the powder to collect at the front of the case and sort of pack in a bit. After firing recoil spreads the powder more evenly along the side of the case which allows the primer to flash over more powder at once. This is true for both the .45 LC and the .38 SPC loads.

Temp wise, we just came back from a shoot and while I didn't chrono anything while we were there, we observed that the .45 LC rounds were getting noticeably "hotter" as the day wore on. Ammo usually sits in a cart which may or ma not be in the shade.

So, my very unscientific conclusion is that Red Dot is both position and temp sensitive. So if you intend to use it for reduced pistol or rifle loads just keep that in mind.

 

[Yetiultimate]

I also shoot Red Dot and have found it to be position sensitive. Never really looked at the temp issue before but now I’m curious. The only thing I really use it for these days is plinking with The Load in my milsurps with cast bullets.

 

[NapalmCheese]

Until I started shooting CAS I had a bunch of it to use specifically for plinker loads in my .30-30. Now I'm finding I'm shooting it in plenty of different cartridges. It works well, but the position sensitivity is something to beware of. If you need to make a minimum power factor you're probably best off making sure you can make that power factor in any temp/position.

 

[brass slinger]

Aren't all spherical powders temperature sensitive? For charges in longer cases, I could see why it might be position sensitive. Wow, some folks out there still use Alliant / Hercules Red Dot. It brings back memories.

 

[NapalmCheese]

Red Dot is a disk powder, so flattened spherical. IIRC Alliant was(is) manufacturing in Redford VA; unlike St. Marks in FL who makes all the ball powders.

That said, it's not at all suprising that Red Dot is temp sensitive; but the sensitivity to temp and position in such a small case (relatively speaking) as .38 SPC was surprising to me.

 

[hambam105]

Someone gave me 2 lbs of Red Dot a few years back. So I loaded ~five hundred 38 Special, 158 cast SWC, 800 feet per second. No big deal.
Well, it turned out to be a big deal.
I'm on a private range, heavy fog rolls in, rain forecasted in a hour. I have two loading blocks and a dozen speed loaders. And one K-Frame S&W.
When the opportunity arrives I shoot a lot and I shoot fast. And I've used the same component parts that produced similar pressures with Hp-38, W231 and Bullseye. No BFD.
But this Red Dot powder residue gunked-up and turned into a orange-redish crud. Lots of smoke & flash.
Every 50 or 60 rounds I had to stop and brush the crud off the action. I never had to do that with W231 powder.
I shot up all those Red Dot loads and gave the remaining powder away. I think there is a reason they call it Red Dot.

There was a PPC competitor friend of mime at Chabot Gun Club for years. He loved Red Dot. And he carried at least 2 military style cleaning bushes with him at all times on the range. Between stages you could always see him brushing down the revolver's action between stages. There was no way he was going to switch powders.